VEENA MERCHANT: Raj, among your clients do you have any Indian American companies?

RAJ MUKHERJEE: Not currently, which is a shame. Because New Jersey has so many Indians.

MERCHANT: Can you tell us how, at your age, you came to be what you are. I understand that you worked for Michael Murphy’s campaign when he ran for governor when you were 12 years old?

MUKHERJEE: Michael Murphy is my partner. He was a Morris County prosecutor in New Jersey and he was a candidate for governor. I have kept my friendship with him since then. I owned an Internet company.

MERCHANT: You already owned a couple of Internet firms?

MUKHERJEE: That is sort of my way of getting into politics. I could tell them that I would make their Websites. I really wanted to get into strategy. Politics is really a disease.

MERCHANT: Upendra, I have never und-erstood lobbying...

UPENDRA CHIVUKULA: Lobbying came from the word lobbyist as they hang around in lobbies of the Capitol Hill or the state legislature. They have an expertise in the issues they are advocating so they educate the legislature.

MERCHANT: But that is the dictionary meaning. How do they function?

CHIVUKULA: They network, hang around in the lobby, make appointments with legislators.

MERCHANT: But that you and I can do that.

CHIVUKULA: To be a lobbyist in the U.S. you have to register with a state. It is a continuous follow-up to get to know the legislators. You and I can hang around there but we may not be able to get access.

MERCHANT: Which means that the law- makers minds can be made up by...

CHIVUKULA: Lobbyists can influence definitely. For example, the AARP (American Association of Retired Persons). They have issues for senior citizens and retired persons. They will try to convince the legislators one way or the other.

MERCHANT: You edit a newspaper, how do you see the whole business of lobbying?

VIRAL KAPADIA: I am a finance student. I see companies affecting politics. It is a freedom of expression and speech. Many people look at it as bribery but it could also be considered as a way of expressing things. I see it as a mix of both – depends on what companies are lobbying for and what issues they are lobbying for. If it is, say, American Israeli Public Affairs Committee it could be lobbying for freedom of speech. If it is Exxon it could be manipulating politicians for whatever they want. It is also an ingrained part of politics, the way the system works.

MERCHANT: As a taxpayer, I don’t like that thought.

MUKHERJEE: It is business like any other business in which transactions happen.

CHIVUKULA: I don’t know whether I agree with that. As a legislator I look at several issues and I don’t have subject expertise, I try to rely on lobbyists to gather information and other people who are experts in the matter.

MERCHANT: Would you consider lobbyists as experts in some subjects?

CHIVUKULA: There are some good lobbyists. I meet them on a regular basis to find out where they are with respect to issues. I agree on some issues and I don’t agree on many issues.

MERCHANT: Viral’s thought was interesting. Freedom of speech versus bribery. What do you feel about that?

CHIVUKULA: There is a lot of misperception about lobbyists. They can be manipulative in the wrong way. Say if you are advocating for cigarette lobby. If you are pushing for cigarettes and saying it is good for health, it is misleading. But there are environmental issues where you need to balance between businesses and the quality of life for people. You have to look at both sides of the issue.

MERCHANT: Raj, take us inside your office and tell us how things are done?

MUKHERJEE: There is more to lobbying thanng doors or making phone call and getting a meeting for a client because you happen to be friends with a legislator. That is part of it. It is a just a way of getting voices to be heard.

MERCHANT: Let us say I want to get something specific done. Do you believe in it or do you take a client for the heck of it?

MUKHERJEE: No. It would be hypocritical to pitch for a client or an issue that I am not in agreement with.

MERCHANT: Can you tell us some issues your company prefers to work with?

MUKHERJEE: When we are not working on behalf of private entities for regulatory matters, let us say, a developer trying to get a construction permit in a certain town. We also work on state level with issue groups.

MERCHANT: Q: How would you get it done?

MUKHERJEE: We will examine the issue and the issue lobbyist from the organization that will help us with this task.

MERCHANT: When you go to the lawmaker what do you say? I am an editor of a newspaper and I make a lot of noise but nobody listens to me.

MUKHERJEE: If Assemblyman Chivukula isn’t returning my calls I will keep calling his staff member till somebody gets back to me. Persistence is a big part of it. A part of it is relationship also, you can’t deny that.

MERCHANT: How do you feel relationship to be quote unquote?

KAPADIA: I agree with Raj. And also going back to getting in contact with a legislator I’d say it wouldn’t exactly be considered bribery because the way the system works, you give the legislator money or fund a campaign you are not getting a law in exchange you are getting them to hear you.

MERCHANT: Upendra why do I have trouble with this?

CHIVUKULA: MERCHANT: What worries me is if someone gave you a million dollars in campaign, all collected legitimately, how tempting is that now?

CHIVUKULA: It can be tempting. You have disclosure laws where every politician has to declare where they are getting the money. Lobbyists too have to do that.

Lobbyists are trying to get their issues or stances of their clients heard by legislators. They want to be heard. It is still going to be upto the lawmaker to make up their own mind.

MERCHANT: Upendra do we need lobbyists to fight the issues of Indian Americans?

CHIVUKULA: Definitely. We do have many organizations like chambers of commerce but we have no issue advocacy group in the South Asian community. We need it because there are issues.business issues whether it is giving a fair share in terms of school construction programs or getting appointments.all this needs access and advocacy.

(Transcribed by Bhavna Kaul)